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Would You Kill Your Child if God Told You To?

 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mixer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 18 2014 at 2:05pm
Oh lord, God Castiel references are being dropped.Sleepy
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote iliveforbhm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 18 2014 at 2:08pm
Originally posted by Random Thoughts Random Thoughts wrote:

Originally posted by Derri Derri wrote:

Explain yourself RT


I say your ego hasn't eroded because you so thoroughly know the thoughts of god and the thoughts of the majority of people who say they don't hear from god. Moreover, the PNAS did a study around 2009 where they MRI'd dozens of people, religious, non-religious, monotheistic, polytheistic. When asked what god thought about a situation, the part of the brain that lit up was the part responsible for what the person thought, not the part of the brain responsible for what someone else thought. So very strong thoughts about what a god would think turned out to be more egocentric than thoughts about other people.

I say your morality has eroded since you admit that you used to have hangups over the thoughts of murdering a child for spiritual reasons, but now you would blindly follow the voice inside of you that you attribute as god. Therefore, you're no longer a moral agent or even practicing morality at all, since that involves making choices based on right and wrong, and not doing something simply because you were told to. You're a soldier following orders.


 
As I thought, most people hear their own thoughts and think of it as "god" and they create their own god which is in the image of themselves.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote Derri Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 18 2014 at 2:11pm
I would agree with you RT, if I used my mind to identify God. But I don't.

Let me be clear that I used to have some hang ups about following God's instruction, not about murdering children.


The point of that situation between Abraham and God was not to murder Isaac, if you read on. The point was for Abraham to see the benefit in trusting God even when his 'rational' brain might be confused because for ABRAHAM'S life journey trusting when the mind couldn't make sense of those PARTICULAR situations that ABRAHAM was about to embark on was pivotal.

I am not Abraham. God may or may not appear to me in the way he did Abraham, and he may or may not ask me to do the exact same thing he asked Abraham. Regarless of if he did, i will ignore my mind's attempt at rationalizing God.

Why? Because my mind can only know what is relative.

You say that my morality had eroded, instead of my ego. My sense of what is right and wrong has eroded, and not my sense of self.

I ask you, this sense of right and wrong that you speak of, how do you know that right is right and wrong is wrong?
For whom is right right, and wrong wrong?

Furthermore, morality is the perfect playground for ego to thrive.
An ego is a sense of I in comparison to the environment of 'good' and 'bad' i.e right and wrong..morals.

In other words, what the 'I' perceives as right and wrong in relation to the environment that the 'I' is in, which the 'I' also judges as 'good' and 'bad'. All ego.








Edited by Derri - Feb 18 2014 at 2:18pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote Oladunni Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 18 2014 at 2:21pm
Originally posted by Derri Derri wrote:


 God is not a show off...that's a human ego trait.

i know this is kinda off topic.. but i disagree...!

God has done plenty of things in the bible that many would consider showing off..

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote Derri Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 18 2014 at 2:34pm
Why wouldn't the part of my mind responsible for what i think light up if someone is askig me to use my own words and my own thoughts to reiterate a principle?

Also, am I somehow separate from God? It is the ego that seeks to separate and create an indiviual identity.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote iliveforbhm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 18 2014 at 2:34pm
That's was part of the research they found out, it was that it was the ego the self lighting up, not what they have learned or gotten from someone else that was lighting up. In other words no regurgitation, but what themselves were spitting out.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote Derri Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 18 2014 at 2:37pm
Originally posted by Oladunni Oladunni wrote:

Originally posted by Derri Derri wrote:


 God is not a show off...that's a human ego trait.

i know this is kinda off topic.. but i disagree...!

God has done plenty of things in the bible that many would consider showing off..


I see what you are saying. From their perspective, their idea of what a show off is.
So when they read the Bible, they read it with a judgemental mind--as in judegment of what is right and wrong--morals again that came from the i's mind.

Edited by Derri - Feb 18 2014 at 2:41pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Derri Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 18 2014 at 2:40pm
Is it a surprise though that the ego wants to be centre stage?
All that study proves is that the ego is tricky. Which is a given.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote iliveforbhm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 18 2014 at 2:40pm
All of the things we think of a creator in some shape or form comes from our ego. We probably know almost zilch and the rest is forms from the minds of men.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Random Thoughts Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Feb 18 2014 at 2:42pm
Originally posted by Derri Derri wrote:

I would agree with you RT, if I used my mind to identify God. But I don't.

Then what do you use? If you are going to say your spirit, then can you demonstrate that a spirit exists?

I am not Abraham. God may or may not appear to me in the way he did Abraham, and he may or may not ask me to do the exact same thing he asked Abraham. Regarless of if he did, i will ignore my mind's attempt at rationalizing God.

Which is why I say you are a solider following orders. You no longer have a sense of morality. Good is good only because God says so.

I ask you, this sense of right and wrong that you speak of, how do you know that right is right and wrong is wrong?  For whom is right right, and wrong wrong?


The study of ethics. But more to the point, recognizing that we are social species and therefore our quality of life is improved when we act in a way that adheres to basic principles surrounding our interactions with each other. Also taking into consideration ideals like health is generally preferable to sickness, life is generally preferable to death, pleasure is generally preferable to pain, and so on. And when those ideals come into conflict, which they often do, then evaluating the ramifications of decisions or actions surrounding the dilemma. It's a system to be learned and adjusted as we better understand each other. But it at least takes our humanity into consideration, unlike following a book that at one point sanctions slavery, sexism, and genocide.

Other social species have senses of morality, right and wrong, and fairness too. Ours is simply more complex because our behavior is more complex.

Furthermore, morality is the perfect playground for ego to thrive.
An ego is a sense of I in comparison to the environment of 'good' and 'bad' i.e right and wrong..morals. In other words, what the 'I' perceives as right and wrong in relation to the environment that the 'I' is in, which the 'I' also judges as 'good' and 'bad'. All ego.

I don't reject the notion that ego plays a part in morality. Part of the reason you do good for others is because you want the same done to you.  I reject the inference that you aren't just as consumed by your ego, which you suggested in your original post when talking about how humble you are in comparison to the ego-driven non-believers.



Edited by Random Thoughts - Feb 18 2014 at 2:50pm
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