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What is the new coarse?

 
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cocopuffs View Drop Down
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    Posted: Apr 03 2013 at 12:07pm
Just wanted to get some understanding (and it may help others) as to what vendors are now categorizing as "coarse". I have bought hair from so many vendors throughout the years and due to the "hair game" it seems that the terminology along with meaning has transformed into something different.

As an example, I have bought (and still use) Lanik's Bellisimo South American hair which was categorized as "coarse". It is curly and has a rougher (more wirey and somewhat crinkled) strand texture as well as a thicker strand than Indian hair. Same with the old Naturegirl 3c hair, but their hair was a thinner strand, but still with the kink along the whole strand while still being very curly. Again, same thing with the older Wagman's hair. I also bought Wagman's from a member a while back and sure enough, the hair was sold as "coarse" and yes, it was wirey, sort of rough textured along the strand while also being very curly.

Now fast forward to today's "coarse." Recently, I bought some Yummy South American "Belleza" categorized as  very rare coarse, but the strands are quite smooth although the hair is curly. After that disappointment, I took the plunge and (though I vowed not to even deal with any type of ridiculous wait time) ordered Jace very coarse straight. Read up on MahoganyRed's hair and ordered based on researching what terms to use to get that very textured look. Again, smooth strands! This is no shade or anything toward these 2 companies. I am aware that despite new and exotic names, that everything is all Chinese/Indian. But still, that is what this stuff was all along right? The ladies at naturegirl told me via e-mail communications that their hair (original 3c) was of Indo-asian derivation. We know the deal with Wagman's being Indian.

Is it to the point that vendors now don't even know true coarse hair to identify it properly? I just don't want more money wasted in pursuit of "coarse" by a previous standard, if the new meaning is thicker stranded or (edited to add--"tighter curled").

Sorry about the long post, but with the knowledge on this board, I am definitely interested in what you ladies think?


Edited by cocopuffs - Apr 03 2013 at 12:13pm
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pinkdiemond View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pinkdiemond Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 03 2013 at 12:39pm
great post...waits for answers
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CrownRhoyale Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 03 2013 at 6:39pm
I think that vendors are categorizing "coarse" as anything that is not silky given the increased demand and popularity of these textures.

I agree with the "buyer's beware" focus of your post...

But I think that women who are searching for and buying these textures need to be especially specific as to what the want. Like OP, I've purchased hair what was advertised as coarse but really has smooth strands and I've purchased hair that, in IMO, is truly coarse.

At the end of the day, I think coarse hair seekers need to be clear about what they want and vocalize that the the vendor. If it doesn't end up to be as coarse as advertised, send it back. But always, always, ALWAYS ask for pictures before having the vendor send it out. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (3) Thanks(3)   Quote beana3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 03 2013 at 8:45pm
This is the reason I am back to processed hair. I've spent thousands in the pursuit of raw virgin coarse hair and have only had true success 3/17 or so times. AVs will classify anything frizzy or non-shiny coarse. I still prefer raw unprocessed hair but I'm not holding my breath for it and im not willing to spend freely on it anymore either.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote ms.blue Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 03 2013 at 8:55pm
I believe I understand what you're saying cocopuff. I think some vendors believe frizzy equal coarse. In my mind, frizzy hair is just parched hair that needs some moisture. Coarse hair can be felt through the hair strands. I had hair which I thought it was coarse because at first glance, it did appear to be "coarse" but turned out to be slightly coarse. My Russian medium coarse from yummy was actually medium coarse which I'm glad. I was stalking mane depot because I wanted real coarse bellerio wavy/curly.hair but I noticed they were having labeling issues plus there were ladies who were having issues with the coarse level the hair...basically not coarse enough. I realized that getting coarse hair is like a game of chance...you.never know what you get is what you expected.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ms.blue Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 03 2013 at 8:56pm
Originally posted by beana3 beana3 wrote:

This is the reason I am back to processed hair. I've spent thousands in the pursuit of raw virgin coarse hair and have only had true success 3/17 or so times. AVs will classify anything frizzy or non-shiny coarse. I still prefer raw unprocessed hair but I'm not holding my breath for it and im not willing to spend freely on it anymore either.


Exactly beana
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (3) Thanks(3)   Quote cocopuffs Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 03 2013 at 10:18pm
It really is a shame that the hair game has devolved the way it has. All of you ladies make great points.
CrownRhoyale- I totally agree that pics should be sought as a condition of purchase. I really should have thought to do that with Jace. It was just that after looking at her vids, she clearly conveyed a knowledge of curl pattern vs. texture. So, I thought I was ok to order the very coarse with them and really did expect to get a much more textured batch. Instead, what I received was just very smooth heavy Asian hair. 

Generally speaking, I have noticed a couple of trends that vendors are engaging in. I know folks need to meet their bottom line and I am not throwing shade. Just observations that may help others when deciding to order:

They will take pics of the hair laying flat/down which can be misleading as to how much curl the hair even has. (I have some 28" long Wagmans that is very curly for its length. I co-washed it and laid it flat to dry, scrunching periodically while on the table and this caused the hair to really curl and wave up. It dried that way. But when I picked the hair up, naturally the weight stretched the curls and it was not as curly).  All it takes is some "pushing" and scrunching of the hair to create the appearance of a more pronounced deeper curl pattern.

Selling bundles with a whole bunch of short hairs and labeling it "coarse". This is particularly an issue with the wavy/curly. You've got a bunch of 1-3 inch hairs toward the weft as well as other short hairs as you go down the length of the bundle and the hairs are going in different directions (I am saying as in east/west- not against the cuticle). When this hair is photographed it looks coarse and bushy, but in reality, the strands themselves are still smooth.

Fluffing. For bundles that have a tighter wave or curl pattern and have consistent strand lengths (so that the bundle is full from weft to tip) the hair is photographed flat and the uniformity of the waves are fluffed. This takes some of the strands out of the wave and "bushes them up" so that, again, the bundle appears  coarser than it is.

Photographing at side angles.  As an example, Mane Depot does this. The hair is hung and photographed with light hitting it at an angle. The hair appears "rough" and crinkly, but to Ms. Blue's point, it is very soft with smooth strands.

"Free" inches. While this is not a coarseness issue, it seems noteworthy that all the gurus go bananas when the hair companies (particularly "Russian") give them longer lengths than they ordered. I know that it can be a pleasant surprise to receive more than you originally purchased. But sometimes people are ordering (like me) a certain length because they want to have the bundles make a full install. When I have ordered 18" lengths and received as much as 4-6" more in length, I no longer have enough for a full install. If you've waited almost 2 months for the hair, this is a bummer. Did I just get what they had laying around? Sigh.

Finally, I do believe and understand that the companies with exorbitant wait times are waiting until they get a bunch of orders so that they can meet their suppliers' minimum. But researching places like el-milano or other CVs, their processing time does NOT take all that time (weeks and weeks) to get to the retailer and the suppliers do have wefted hair already. I have noticed that these AVs ship hair out at least a week past your 45-day paypal period.Wink

It seems that the new coarse is only an illusion!Ouch

Edited by cocopuffs - Apr 03 2013 at 10:21pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote natalie2u Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 03 2013 at 10:31pm
Great post! I had the same issue with some "kinky" curly...it was just VERY curly but the strands were smooth and not really coarse..I couldn't get it to blend with my naps and had to make a wig.

I think it's a human hair shortage, period..maybe the yak/horse/monkey/human hair blend doesn't take processing as well so the product is left more in it's natural state..too much processing to make it coarse may ruin it,causing poor rep/sales
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chatnoir Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 04 2013 at 11:18am
I agree with all of the above comments, especially as to being very specific when asking for the type of hair that is required by the customer.

Typically Chinese hair is coarse (thicker strands), Indian hair is fine.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote missyo67 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr 04 2013 at 4:11pm

Great informational post!!! 

The marketing campaigns for extensions are geared for the uneducated consumer.  The vendors (most of them) aren't as educated as we are. They are able to reach temporary "success" by catering to the misinformed consumer while the rest of us suffer with risky purchases.
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