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To the first generation 'new worlders..

 
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JoliePoufiasse View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JoliePoufiasse Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 05 2013 at 3:43am
Originally posted by newdiva1 newdiva1 wrote:

Originally posted by JoliePoufiasse JoliePoufiasse wrote:

Originally posted by mizzsandra00 mizzsandra00 wrote:

I wish my grandmother would have taught us french......I get a lil jelly when other people can have side convos in another language.......
 
Well, if you're Haitian and were raised in the U.S., that sort of makes sense. None of my cousins who are born and raised in the U.S. speak any French at all. They communicated with family in creole (and even that is somewhat rusty! It's more that they understand creole perfectly). Ironically one of my cousins married a white dude with French roots and now she regrets it!
 
My situation is different because I was raised in French Canada and went through the French school system up until university. So it made sense that my parents would speak to me both in creole and in French growing up, plus French was my first language in school and society. I learned English as a teenager, through watching soap operas mostly (lol) and through listening to music and reading novels.

 

Why?
 
Because her in-laws speak French and she doesn't. Her being of Haitian descent makes it even worse for her not to know any French at all.
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newdiva1 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote newdiva1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 05 2013 at 3:43am
dang.  that sucks.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CherryBlossom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 05 2013 at 3:45am
I'd be so embarrassed 
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JoliePoufiasse View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote JoliePoufiasse Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 05 2013 at 3:57am
@ New Diva: Yeah, it does. Truth be told, people born and raised in the States that are of Haitian descent should be trilingual (English, creole and French), imo. But as a few people stated, a lot of black children of immigrants (not all, of course) tend to not value their parents' linguistic heritage. Other ethnic groups like Chinese or latinos will not do that. Never met a north American raised Chinese that didn't speak Chinese.
 
I think that in the States (for Haitians anyway), it has to do with several factors. First, creole being the language used between intimates, it makes sense that parents would speak it to their kids. Secondly, American culture is kind of self-absorbed in a way (no, not tryna diss America, just stating the fact that americans see themselves as the center of the universe and only America and English matters). Thirdly, until recently, a lot of Haitian-Americans felt it wasn't cool to identify as Haitian and were berated by other blacks for it. It's only in recent years that Haitian-americans came to claim it and a lot of them still don't.


Edited by JoliePoufiasse - Jul 05 2013 at 4:03am
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JoliePoufiasse View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote JoliePoufiasse Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 05 2013 at 4:02am
Originally posted by CherryBlossom CherryBlossom wrote:

I'd be so embarrassed 
 
I would be too. Especially when you consider the implications (hopefully, the in-laws don't know this) that in Haiti, not speaking any French usually denotes being of a lower class. In my father's time, school was not thought in creole and creole hadn't been codified in written form. So it was imperative for the educated to speak it. Nowadays, lots of public schools don't even bother with French anymore. Only in private school do you learn it properly. I think it's a huge mistake on the part of the Haitian government because only a handful of countries speak creole and it's not necessarily the same creole. You have a generation of kids who either don't speak French in Haiti itself because they are poor or do speak it but atrociously so.


Edited by JoliePoufiasse - Jul 05 2013 at 4:05am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CherryBlossom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 05 2013 at 4:12am
Originally posted by JoliePoufiasse JoliePoufiasse wrote:

Originally posted by CherryBlossom CherryBlossom wrote:

I'd be so embarrassed 
 
I would be too. Especially when you consider the implications (hopefully, the in-laws don't know this) that in Haiti, not speaking any French usually denotes being of a lower class. In my father's time, school was not thought in creole and creole hadn't been codified in written form. So it was imperative for the educated to speak it. Nowadays, lots of public schools don't even bother with French anymore. Only in private school do you learn it properly. I think it's a huge mistake on the part of the Haitian government because only a handful of countries speak creole and it's not necessarily the same creole. You have a generation of kids who either don't speak French in Haiti itself because they are poor or do speak it but atrociously so.
Wow Jolie, that's very interesting! I had no idea it was like that in Haiti...I just always assumed that the language of the coloniser would always be the one that was spoken first and foremost especially in schools. 

I think it's a mistake too, French is so widely spoken around the world, it would be a shame to deny children the right to speak it.

Honestly, I think my embarrassment would stem from having a white hubby who can speak my language better than I can...lol it sounds bad but that's how I'd feel...embarrassed and insulted tbh.
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JoliePoufiasse View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JoliePoufiasse Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 05 2013 at 4:19am
Originally posted by CherryBlossom CherryBlossom wrote:

Originally posted by JoliePoufiasse JoliePoufiasse wrote:

Originally posted by CherryBlossom CherryBlossom wrote:

I'd be so embarrassed 
 
I would be too. Especially when you consider the implications (hopefully, the in-laws don't know this) that in Haiti, not speaking any French usually denotes being of a lower class. In my father's time, school was not thought in creole and creole hadn't been codified in written form. So it was imperative for the educated to speak it. Nowadays, lots of public schools don't even bother with French anymore. Only in private school do you learn it properly. I think it's a huge mistake on the part of the Haitian government because only a handful of countries speak creole and it's not necessarily the same creole. You have a generation of kids who either don't speak French in Haiti itself because they are poor or do speak it but atrociously so.
Wow Jolie, that's very interesting! I had no idea it was like that in Haiti...I just always assumed that the language of the coloniser would always be the one that was spoken first and foremost especially in schools. 

I think it's a mistake too, French is so widely spoken around the world, it would be a shame to deny children the right to speak it.

Honestly, I think my embarrassment would stem from having a white hubby who can speak my language better than I can...lol it sounds bad but that's how I'd feel...embarrassed and insulted tbh.
To be specific, creole is in great part the language of the coloniser. It's mostly old French mixed with a little bit of Spanish and a tiny bit of English (since Americans invaded the country in the 20's) along with various African dialects from the slaves. It's how the slaves from different African nations managed to communicate with each other and white Haitians also use it with intimates. But French was always school thought. Which meant that if you were poor and illiterate, you couldn't necessarily speak it. Now it's even worse because in the last few decades, creole got codified in written form even though it's a patois. However the elite newspapers for instance are all in French. Books are in French. So if you don't speak it, chances are you are poor and poorly educated.
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HaitianDiva64 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HaitianDiva64 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 05 2013 at 5:07am
Originally posted by rickysrose rickysrose wrote:


I was born, raised and lived in North America most of my life

but when I step foot in the Caribbean it feels like home in such a primal way




This, i was scared as hell getting on that plane now I'm looking for a house there. Growing up my fam would tease I'm not true haitian but once i step foot on that soil nothing but love.

Now i feel I'm more haitian than american even though i was born and raised in America
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sbrownie84 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 05 2013 at 11:57am
Originally posted by rickysrose rickysrose wrote:

sbrownie are you talking about or influenced by not being accepted as "local" or genuine in your parents' home country?

I am Jamaican, always will be but I realize that living in Jamaica, I wouldn't necessarily be seen that way but that doesn't affect my affinity

people stereotype, you can use it to your advantage sometimes, sometimes you just have to shrug but I wouldn't let that take away from who you are




Yes, I am talking about that for the most part. I can even go as further with my mom who came to the states in her teens and have lived here since but is still very connected with her country. So much in fact that she did nit assimilate at all. My mother is an intelligent woman and is to s certain extent very worldly and exposed but I only realized this year that the small gap of misunderstanding in our relationship is cultural. There are certain behaviors that she accepts from others in light of ' culture' and I deem as disrespectful. I realized that she connects more with my cousins or family members that are still in her country as opposed to me In Certain instances. It is always a battle if what is better amongst us as opposed to trying to understand each other.

It's hard to form an example but I can give s quick one. In her country it is ok to lie and gossip about ppl behind their backs bc it is the culture. Whereas in America there are major reprecusions for slander. That is just a small example of what I mean.   
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sleek Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jul 05 2013 at 1:12pm
Born in Barbados came to the states when i was 3 im more Bajan than America
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