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Visual examples of textures and types COMPLETE!

Printed From: Black Hair Media Forum
Category: Natural Hair Care
Forum Name: Natural Hair Care
Forum Description: General Discussions on Natural Hair Care
URL: http://Forum.BlackHairMedia.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=326012
Printed Date: Oct 15 2018 at 10:42pm


Topic: Visual examples of textures and types COMPLETE!
Posted By: Lilnicka4u2nv
Subject: Visual examples of textures and types COMPLETE!
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 12:14am

To start off lets read a break down of each and everyone...


   Hair Types


We come in all shapes, sizes and colors... and our hair comes in all shapes, widths and textures. It is difficult to categorize hair because of all the variation that occurs. However, attempts have been made to categorize in an effort to help people better know their hair.

Black/afro-type hair is difficult to categorize for a few reasons:

1) our hair differs in pattern - coils, springs. zig zags, s-curves

2) our hair differs in pattern size - watch spring to chalk size

3) our hair differs in density - sparse, dense

4) our hair differs in strand diameter - fine, medium, coarse

5) our hair differs in feel - cottony, spongy,silky,thready,wiry




Strand Size/Diameter:

To get the hair strand size, take a piece of sewing thread and unravel it into two pieces. Compare this to your hair.  If the strand of hair is the same thickness as the thread then you have medium/normal size.  If it’s thicker than the thread, you have a thick strand.  If it’s thinner than the thread, you have a fine strand.

Texture:

Thready-  hair has a low sheen, with a high shine while the hair is being held taught with low frizz.  Wets easily but dries quickly.

Wiry – has a sparkly sheen with low shine and low frizz. Water bounces or beads up on the hair strand.  Hair never seems to get fully wet.

Cottony – has a low sheen, a high shine if hair is held taut and has high frizz.  Absorbs water quickly but does not get thoroughly wet very fast.

Spongy – high sheen, with low shine with a compacted looking frizz.  Absorbs water before it gets thoroughly wet.

Silky – low sheen and very high shine with a lot or low frizz.  Easily wets in water.

The trick is to hold your hair taut when determining spongy vs cottony.  So what does “sheen” & “shiny” mean?   Sheen is a dull reflection of light like a luster, the hair sparkles as light bounces off of it.  Shine has a sharp reflection of light (like the shine of straight hair or a shine of jewelry as an exaggeration).  Here are two pictures of examples of sheen vs shine:

This is hair w/ a SHEEN when held taut.

This is hair w/ SHINE when held taut.

Pattern:

The letters LOIS describes the curl pattern if it in those shapes of the letters.

L = I shaped strands (Hair has bends, right angles and folds with little to no curve)

O = round circular coils (Strands looks like a slinky, spirals or zeros)

I = straight with angular sharp bends (Hair lies mostly flat with no distinctive curve or bend)

S = s curls (Hair shaped like the letter S, wavy looking)

 


Porosity & Dew Point

Porosity

There is a great article which I found article written by Tonya McKay.  She explains porosity and what it means in great detail.  I’ll repost it in its entirety.

Porosity is the term used in the science of hair care to describe how easily water and other matter can diffuse back and forth through the cuticle layer and into or out of the cortex. Hair is much like a sponge, capable of absorbing water and other substances from the environment, and also susceptible to losing precious moisture and lipids to the environment. Maintaining an optimal balance of moisture in your hair preserves its suppleness, strength, and shine. This is especially important for those of us with curly hair, as it greatly influences the health and beauty of our tresses.


Porosity Classifications

The individual scales of the cuticle overlap one another like the feathers of a bird or scales on a fish. This amazing system of flexible and responsive scales allows diffusion of oils and moisture into and out of the hair as needed. Porosity is determined by how tightly the cuticle scales adhere to the surface of the hair shaft and also by how thoroughly adjacent scales overlap one another.

Low Porosity: Hair described as having low porosity is characterized by a very tightly bound cuticle layer, where the individual cuticle scales lie flat and overlap one another. Low porosity hair is often quite shiny, especially if it is a darker color. Overall this type of hair is considered to be quite healthy. If your hair repels water when you attempt to wet it, that is a good indication that it has low porosity. It can be quite difficult to process, because it resists penetration of the chemicals being used.

Low porosity hair is more prone to an excessive accumulation of protein if deep conditioning products are used and will feel very stiff and straw-like. It requires products rich in moisture and emollients and also benefits most from products that contain humectants, which attract moisture to the hair and hold it there. If hair with very few or very small openings becomes dry for some reason, it can be more difficult to restore proper moisture balance to it. In this case, a deep conditioning treatment with moderate heat would be a good way to ensure the cuticle is sufficiently opened up to allow moisture to enter into the cortex.

Normal Porosity: Hair possessing average porosity will generally require the least amount of maintenance. It allows moisture to pass into the cortex as needed, but resists permitting too much water to penetrate. Repeated works by various research groups have found that healthy hair of average porosity can absorb water up to a maximum of 31.1% by weight. Normal porosity hair has a tendency to hold styles well. Perming or coloring can be done in a predictable manner, following the usual guidelines of the product. However, one must note that these processes will damage the hair and increase its porosity over time. An occasional deep conditioning treatment with a protein-containing product will be of benefit, but proteins should not be included in the daily regimen.

Opened highly porous cuticle

High Porosity: High porosity is an unfortunate result of damage to the hair. Chemical processes, harsh treatment, and environmental exposure are all responsible for causing cumulative, irreversible damage to the cuticle layer. This damage creates gaps and holes in the surface of the hair shaft—essentially chinks in its armor. Hair with this type of uneven, pitted and rough surface is prone to damage from more and more sources, resulting in a cascade of effects that culminate in unmanageable and unlovely locks.

Hair with a great deal of porosity has been found to be capable of absorbing significantly higher amounts of water than hair or normal or low porosity (up to 55%, in contrast with 31.1% for healthy hair). Excessive absorption of water from the atmosphere causes frizz and tangling on humid days. Total immersion of high porosity hair during bathing, swimming, or shampooing can lead to significant breakage due to loss of elasticity from the sheer weight of the water absorbed. It also takes on color much more quickly and in higher concentrations than normal porosity hair when undergoing a chemical color process.

People with high porosity hair should use products with lots of moisturizers and emollients and also use anti-humectants in high heat and humidity climates in order to seal their cuticle against excessive absorption of moisture from the air. Protein treatments can also be very helpful for patching some of the holes in the hair, but one must follow up with moisturizing products in order to avoid a stiff texture. Rinsing with a slightly acidic rinse will help flatten and seal the cuticle. Some clear color applications have proteins in them than can patch the gaps in your hair also. Consult your professional hair stylist for more information about such products.




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Replies:
Posted By: Lilnicka4u2nv
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 12:16am

Wiry – has a sparkly sheen with low shine and low frizz. Water bounces or beads up on the hair strand.  Hair never seems to get fully wet.

They seem to get easier "hang"...

  I've read people say wiry hair straightens itself out as it dries...Like if you were to pull it  back into a ponytail it may stay straight...sounds familiar Natalee? LOL

Naturals with Coarse and Wirey hair...


Kinkerbelle  http://public.fotki.com/Kinkerbelle/2008/april---june/immediateshrinkage.html - clean hair

 Suthrn QT  http://public.fotki.com/suthrnqt/ - http://public.fotki.com/suthrnqt/
"i look lost in this picture, lol. this is my "soaking" wet hair after stepping out of the shower; even while i'm in the shower, standing under the water, it looks about the same as this. water forms beads/droplets on my hair, and then just seems to sit there; the droplets will also run down my scalp and drip off of my hair, which makes my ends dry out kind of quickly. so, while my hair holds water, it's not really wet...more like damp, kind of. my roots stay damp for a while."





Close ups 







Wirey/thready hair
http://public.fotki.com/IsItOnlyHair/natural-hair--year-/2011/april-2011/aprils-here.html - http://public.fotki.com/IsItOnlyHair/natural-hair--year-/2011/april-2011/aprils-here.html







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Posted By: Lilnicka4u2nv
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 12:18am
Next up : THREADY HAIR





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Posted By: .hott.pink.
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 7:44am
Um...but how can you tell if what you're looking at is sheen or shine?

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I'm only here because I'm bored. Don't expect much.


Posted By: Swift
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 8:01am
I love you, Nike!  You rock for doing this!!

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BC: 10-Jun-09, 0" Ceasar
Ayurveda * Low cones/sulfates * Low Manipulation
LTG: Big poofy hair
Trying to KISS
http://public.fotki.com/MzSwift/


Posted By: Lilnicka4u2nv
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 1:34pm
Originally posted by .hott.pink. .hott.pink. wrote:

Um...but how can you tell if what you're looking at is sheen or shine?

Sheen is a more dull reflection of light...


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Posted By: Lolliren
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 1:38pm
Nike, since you're low porosity, what texture are you?


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Posted By: UrEpiphany
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 1:49pm
Thanks for the thorough information...now, what kind of porosity does my hair have??Confused


Posted By: Lilnicka4u2nv
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 1:55pm
Originally posted by Lolliren Lolliren wrote:

Nike, since you're low porosity, what texture are you?


I have a silkish/cottony texture I guess I say cottony because of how thick my hair is....


  You can be any porosity with any texture, but it is common for wiry and silky types to have lower porosity, they each have different reasons why...

   The cuticle of silky hair is flatter hence the reason why they have a higher reflection of light...The flatter cuticles enable hair to retain moisture better...But here's a draw back with silky types, it is more sensitive to over moisturizing and can look greasy and weighed down...

   With wiry textures...if you look in the pictures above you will notice that the water beads on top of the strand, and it take's a while for the hair to get wet, while silkish hair wets easily but takes forever to dry...





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Posted By: bbthamd
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 1:56pm
If there is ever a Mt. Rushmore of Natural Hair you will definitely get my vote to be on it. This is too good.

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Last Relaxer: 5/26/2009

Big Chop: 1/23/2010


Posted By: UrEpiphany
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 1:58pm
Not trying to be rude or take over your thread. But, I found this porosity "test" on a website:  http://www.curlynikki.com/2011/08/how-to-find-your-hair-porosity-and.html - http://www.curlynikki.com/2011/08/how-to-find-your-hair-porosity-and.html

Here's to hoping I made a contribution, LOL.Wink

For hair porosity, you want to feel your hair while it is wet, and the technique is the same for all hair types. 
  1. Squeeze or blot excess moisture from your hair so that it is not dripping, but leave it as wet as possible.
  2. If it feels rough or has a “straw-like” texture, your hair is not very porous.
  3. If your hair simply feels wet, you have normal hair porosity.
  4. If your hair has high porosity, it will feel sticky, almost as if you had not washed all product out of your hair. 
Thanks again for the information NickaClap


Posted By: Lilnicka4u2nv
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 2:05pm
Originally posted by UrEpiphany UrEpiphany wrote:

Not trying to be rude or take over your thread. But, I found this porosity "test" on a website:  http://www.curlynikki.com/2011/08/how-to-find-your-hair-porosity-and.html - http://www.curlynikki.com/2011/08/how-to-find-your-hair-porosity-and.html

Here's to hoping I made a contribution, LOL.Wink

For hair porosity, you want to feel your hair while it is wet, and the technique is the same for all hair types. 
  1. Squeeze or blot excess moisture from your hair so that it is not dripping, but leave it as wet as possible.
  2. If it feels rough or has a “straw-like” texture, your hair is not very porous.
  3. If your hair simply feels wet, you have normal hair porosity.
  4. If your hair has high porosity, it will feel sticky, almost as if you had not washed all product out of your hair. 
Thanks again for the information NickaClap

thank you for posting and I'd love more contributions !!!! 


  Also try this test...the sink or float...CurlyNikki shows a great visual example of porosity

SO FINE: Porosity and Why it Matters
by Cassidy of  http://naturalselectionblog.com/ - Natural Selection Blog


"Great, I've got fine hair too!! So. Whatproductsdoyouusewhatshouldiusehowshouldistylewhereshouldibuyhowmuchshouldiusecanyoupleasetellmeeverythingineedtoknowaboutfinehairnowwwwww???" 

This has been an extremely popular question I've been getting in comments and emails since jumping into the So Fine Series to which I can only respond with one thing:

HOLD YOUR HORSES, YOU FINE THANGS YOU! We've gotta talk about porosity first.

To all of you whose eyes just glazed over because you get confused about all of this science-y hair stuff, keep reading (and stop pulling at your coils!! Remember: fine hair is fragile!!!). I promise I'm going to make this easy.

What is porosity? Porosity in hair-speak is a way of saying " a strand's ability to soak up and let go of moisture."

While I would love to keep that  http://www.curlynikki.com/2011/02/so-fine-natural-hair-part-2.html - , I can't and we're going to talk about porosity in terms of SPONGES.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-TWpNi9vvra0/TWT5i3I3C5I/AAAAAAAAL6w/KfyKVLsj8oU/s1600/SPONGE%2B1.JPG"> This is a normal sponge. It absorbs and lets go of water at a normal rate.


http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-JW7jDLE9cGo/TWT5jDRihdI/AAAAAAAAL64/9lI1qcpfln0/s1600/SPONGE%2B2.JPG"> This is a sponge in a plastic bag. If you submerge the bag beneath water, the water will eventually get inside the bag, but it will take longer and more effort to fully soak the sponge. It is also more difficult to get the water out.


http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-dIZlzzHUQGg/TWT5jS9jRmI/AAAAAAAAL7A/tSPvUy-Hr-s/s1600/SPONGE%2B3.JPG"> This is a sponge that I took a pair of scissors to. The larger holes in this one mean that water seeps into and squishes out more easily than the above sponges with normal and low porosity.


Now take these same concepts and apply them to your hair.
  • Normal sponge = hair with normal porosity. Moisture goes in and out of hair with relative ease at a neither breakneck nor snails pace.
  • Sponge in plastic bag = hair with low porosity. It takes a lot more work to moisturize this kind of hair because its harder for moisture to get in. But once you get that moisture in, its harder for it to get out.
  • Holey Sponge = hair with high porosity. This kind of hair absorbs - and loses - moisture much more easily. Normal porosity falls somewhere in the middle of these two.
Think of it this way: High porosity = easy in/easy out. Low porosity = difficult to get in/difficult to get out.

How do you figure out what level of porosity you have?

I've heard of three methods for figuring out your porosity.

1. The Slip'n'Slide Test: Take a strand of hair and slide your fingers up the shaft (toward the scalp). If you feel little bumps along the way, this means that your cuticle is lifted and that you have high porosity. If it slips smoothly down, then you're on the lower end of the scale. The

2. The Sink-or-Float Test: Take a strand of hair and place it in a glass of water. If it sinks quickly, its high porosity. If it takes some time to sink, then its normal porosity. If it just stays floating near the top, then its low porosity.



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Posted By: MsDidi13
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 2:11pm
This thread is super FABULOUS!!!  Thank you for posting!!!!  Now I am trying to figure out what my hair is!!!!  :D!


Posted By: Rumbera
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 2:13pm
Originally posted by Lilnicka4u2nv Lilnicka4u2nv wrote:

Originally posted by Lilnicka4u2nv Lilnicka4u2nv wrote:

Wiry – has a sparkly sheen with low shine and low frizz. Water bounces or beads up on the hair strand.  Hair never seems to get fully wet.

They seem to get easier "hang"...

  I've read people say wiry hair straightens itself out as it dries...Like if you were to pull it  back into a ponytail it may stay straight...sounds familiar Natalee? LOL

Naturals with Coarse and Wirey hair...
Wirey/thready hair
http://public.fotki.com/IsItOnlyHair/natural-hair--year-/2011/april-2011/aprils-here.html - http://public.fotki.com/IsItOnlyHair/natural-hair--year-/2011/april-2011/aprils-here.html





This is me !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  I think she is my hair twin too.. My hair doesn't curl like it used too


Posted By: Lilnicka4u2nv
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 2:18pm
Rumby arent you silk textured as well???....I'll be posting those soon....you'll people whose hair look more like yours texturewise...

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Posted By: Rumbera
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 2:25pm
*waits*
 
 


Posted By: Meme0887
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 2:34pm
Hmm I think Im on the spongy side with normal porosity

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Posted By: NataleeC
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 2:50pm
Hey, Nike, can you post pics of the different types now?
Like 4a curls, 4b, etc?

Just to make this thread complete lol.
Then we can make it a sticky!

Lol, but forreal doe.. do it please?

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APL BSL ~MBL~ WL
Start Length: CBL
Hair length post cut: FNL
Cut Date: Nov 28,2010
Hair Goal for 2012: MBL/WL
Status: Transitioning.
PS: Full Sew Ins
Journey Start Date: Feb. 21, 2010.


Posted By: Lilnicka4u2nv
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 2:56pm
Thready-  hair has a low sheen, with a high shine while the hair is being held taught with low frizz.  Wets easily but dries quickly.

 Typically, thready hair may have a slightly larger diameter and feels uneven but still smooth along the hair strand. 

   Sometimes, it even has a halo-y appearance, much like a strand of thread. This type of hair generally has a lower porosity and can "feel" coarse even though the strands may be fine.


       Naturals with thready hair

Kblc06- 3b,3c  thready w/fine-medium strands   http://public.fotki.com/kblc06-02/ - http://public.fotki.com/kblc06-02/



Kutenkurly, 4a, thready w/coarse strands  http://public.fotki.com/kutenkurly/ - http://public.fotki.com/kutenkurly/



More thready heads













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Posted By: Lilnicka4u2nv
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 2:57pm
Originally posted by NataleeC NataleeC wrote:

Hey, Nike, can you post pics of the different types now?
Like 4a curls, 4b, etc?

Just to make this thread complete lol.
Then we can make it a sticky!

Lol, but forreal doe.. do it please?

that's what i'm making sure to do within each texture babes...its gonna take a while for me to gather each...



#dead at the bolded LOL


anything for ya'll!!!


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Posted By: NataleeC
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 3:00pm
GRASSYASS!!



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APL BSL ~MBL~ WL
Start Length: CBL
Hair length post cut: FNL
Cut Date: Nov 28,2010
Hair Goal for 2012: MBL/WL
Status: Transitioning.
PS: Full Sew Ins
Journey Start Date: Feb. 21, 2010.


Posted By: Lilnicka4u2nv
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 3:01pm
Next up: COTTONY HAIR


also if any of ya'll are aware of your texture and wanna give me some pics , feel free to PM me Tongue


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Posted By: AmberColour
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 3:08pm
Thanks this is great! :)
I'll bookmark this later.LOL


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Posted By: mskraizy
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 3:09pm
Nike this is AWESOME!!! This needs to be added to the Natural Hair 101 thread AND need to be made in a sticky!!!

I've always thought I had spongy hair with normal porosity and this just confirms it! YES! Go nelly, go nelly *cabbage patchin*


I just did the Porosity test (just to clarify). How sad that I got excited over it like a science experiment. lol


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"We're all in the same game, just different levels...
Dealing with the same hell, just different devils..."



Check me out at
http://uncommitedcoils.wordpress.com


Posted By: Meme0887
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 3:36pm
Oh interesting..I guess its not normal porosity...my strands dont sink

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Posted By: ChocolatePie777
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 3:45pm
according to the thread test my hair is fine....really fine...and extra fineLOL

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"I came into this World kicking and screaming and covered in someone else's blood; I wouldn't mind going out the same way"


Posted By: niki_p
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 3:52pm
thanks Nike!! I can never figure out the thready, cottony aspect of my hair. I know I have low porosity as I did the strand in a cup test and my hair took more than a minute for parts of it to get under the surface of the water, and almost 2 minutes to go completely under.


Posted By: Lilnicka4u2nv
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 3:59pm
Cottony – has a low sheen, a high shine if hair is held taut and has high frizz.  Absorbs water quickly but does not get thoroughly wet very fast.

   Product free cottony hair tends to have a puffy appearance regardless of curl type but they can get shine when hair is pulled up or curls are defined...

NATURALS WITH COTTONY HAIR

  Mooks!! 4a/b cottony, she's known for having that Rudy Huxtable hair, and banging styles  http://public.fotki.com/Mooks-hair/ - http://public.fotki.com/Mooks-hair/


ShidaNatural


More cottony heads

Looser patterned cottonheads

MissNorway 3c/4a  http://public.fotki.com/MissNorway/ - http://public.fotki.com/MissNorway/

More looser pattern cottonheads








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Posted By: friendlycandice
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 4:07pm
omg love this thread!!


Posted By: Mamacita
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 4:11pm

VERY INFORMATIVE THREAD NIKA

 Heart IT



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A donde el corazón se inclina, el pie camina.
***********
HL: APL
HG: BSBL
HT: 2C,3A

Body: Weight Trainin, Increase in Cal intake, Balance Diet

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qs3Hq4Za51k


Posted By: Lilnicka4u2nv
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 4:14pm
Next up: SPONGY HAIR, which often gets confused for cottony, this shall be interesting...

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Posted By: Lilnicka4u2nv
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 5:55pm
Spongy – high sheen, with low shine with a compacted looking frizz.  Absorbs water before it gets thoroughly wet.

Spongy types tend to need to  squeeze their hair like you squeeze a sponge when you're trying to get it soaked or else it takes forever for the inside to get wet


Now, what is the difference between spongy and cottony Confused?

The trick is to hold your hair taut when determining spongy vs cottony.  So what does “sheen” & “shiny” mean?   Sheen is a dull reflection of light like a luster, the hair sparkles as light bounces off of it.  Shine has a sharp reflection of light (like the shine of straight hair or a shine of jewelry as an exaggeration).


So remember ,cottony hair has shine, only when pulled taut...

Spongy hair has a high sheen regardless, and can probably  achieve some shine when slicked up, and with certain products, or if they manage their high porosity  with cuticle sealing  products like apple cider vinegar , or Roux Porosity Control...

Spongy hair benefits from protein since, protein attracts moisture

Spongy hair also loves butters on wet hair

NATURALS WITH SPONGY HAIR
Slimwavy ; 4a/3c, coarse spongy hair  http://slimwavy.blogspot.com/2011/02/accepted-and-acceptable.html - http://slimwavy.blogspot.com/2011/02/accepted-and-acceptable.html


Other spongy heads
Spongey w/ product








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Posted By: goofyBee
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 5:57pm
yep....I'm cottony


Posted By: mskraizy
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 6:05pm
Spongy all the waaaay!

So I guess Spongebob and i are related...


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"We're all in the same game, just different levels...
Dealing with the same hell, just different devils..."



Check me out at
http://uncommitedcoils.wordpress.com


Posted By: Lilnicka4u2nv
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 6:08pm
Next Up: Silky

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Posted By: nubiennze
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 6:20pm
Heart this thread!


Posted By: Meme0887
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 6:23pm
Yep spongy Smile

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Posted By: Lilnicka4u2nv
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 8:35pm
Silky – low sheen and very high shine with a lot or low frizz.  Easily wets in water.

There are alot of misconception's about silky textured hair

Silky textures comes in 3a to 4b patterns, it's just that the angles and bends of curly to kinkier patterns alter the shine factor.

A 4a silky may appear 3c'ish because of the downward way it grows.

Silky hair can come in coarse or fine strand sizes.


Silky textures have high molding ability, rollersets aren't super challenging.

Silky hair has a tendency to straighten out from ponytails such and stretch out as it gets old...





NATURALS WITH SILKY HAIR

Nikstar, 3c/4a ,coarse, full density and silky, click on link to view  http://public.fotki.com/nik-star/all-natural-year-4/jan-june-2011/ -
Yekinae, another coarse and silky  http://whatsnew.fotki.com/Miane/ - http://whatsnew.fotki.com/Miane/


ClarkiesMommy ;  3c/4a, fine, thin density, silky  http://public.fotki.com/ClarkiesMommy/2009/septemberoctober-2009/ - http://public.fotki.com/ClarkiesMommy/2009/septemberoctober-2009/
Cheleigh ; 4a and silky


BHM's very own Wink Me! 3c/4a, fine-medium, full density, silky  http://public.fotki.com/lilnicka4u2nv/ -

More Silky Heads



Silky 4a-4bs!















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Posted By: .hott.pink.
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 8:53pm
Information overload.  I'll have to come back and read this thread later.

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I'm only here because I'm bored. Don't expect much.


Posted By: Melialy
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 8:59pm
Great thread!! Thumbs Up

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It all started in 1920. <3


Posted By: niki_p
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 9:00pm
Nike I have a question: what does compacted frizz mean?


Posted By: NataleeC
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 9:00pm
-sniff sniff-
~wipes solitary tear~

Nike, WHYY?? Making me having to restrain myself from grabbing scissors and shidd!



-------------
APL BSL ~MBL~ WL
Start Length: CBL
Hair length post cut: FNL
Cut Date: Nov 28,2010
Hair Goal for 2012: MBL/WL
Status: Transitioning.
PS: Full Sew Ins
Journey Start Date: Feb. 21, 2010.


Posted By: NataleeC
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 9:01pm
Originally posted by niki_p niki_p wrote:

Nike I have a question: what does compacted frizz mean?


I think it's frizz that stays close to your scalp..

-------------
APL BSL ~MBL~ WL
Start Length: CBL
Hair length post cut: FNL
Cut Date: Nov 28,2010
Hair Goal for 2012: MBL/WL
Status: Transitioning.
PS: Full Sew Ins
Journey Start Date: Feb. 21, 2010.


Posted By: Lilnicka4u2nv
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 9:10pm
Originally posted by NataleeC NataleeC wrote:

-sniff sniff-
~wipes solitary tear~

Nike, WHYY?? Making me having to restrain myself from grabbing scissors and shidd!


Evil Smile


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Posted By: Lilnicka4u2nv
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 9:13pm
Originally posted by NataleeC NataleeC wrote:

Originally posted by niki_p niki_p wrote:

Nike I have a question: what does compacted frizz mean?


I think it's frizz that stays close to your scalp..

yup...dense packed together frizz


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Posted By: NataleeC
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 9:20pm
Originally posted by Lilnicka4u2nv Lilnicka4u2nv wrote:


Originally posted by NataleeC NataleeC wrote:

-sniff sniff-
~wipes solitary tear~

Nike, WHYY?? Making me having to restrain myself from grabbing scissors and shidd!



Evil Smile

You're horrible.

-------------
APL BSL ~MBL~ WL
Start Length: CBL
Hair length post cut: FNL
Cut Date: Nov 28,2010
Hair Goal for 2012: MBL/WL
Status: Transitioning.
PS: Full Sew Ins
Journey Start Date: Feb. 21, 2010.


Posted By: PowerPuffGirl
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 9:30pm
Cottony like I thought Smile

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Your resident militant Natural

Truly Black > Creamy Crack

Although I walk through the valley of flat irons and lyes, I will fear no breakage, for I am Naptural.


Posted By: niki_p
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 9:42pm
Originally posted by Lilnicka4u2nv Lilnicka4u2nv wrote:

Originally posted by NataleeC NataleeC wrote:

Originally posted by niki_p niki_p wrote:

Nike I have a question: what does compacted frizz mean?


I think it's frizz that stays close to your scalp..

yup...dense packed together frizz
hmmm, thanks. I'm a bit confused. I thought my hair was silky but it doesn't look like the pics posted. Or it could be and combined with other factors or mixed with thready/cottony etc which makes it respond differently.Confused


Posted By: Momeijheii
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 9:42pm
Spongy-wongy 


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Chubby chicken bringing the ruckus. It's tha killa called Momehjijijijijiji



Posted By: Lilnicka4u2nv
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 9:46pm
Originally posted by niki_p niki_p wrote:

Originally posted by Lilnicka4u2nv Lilnicka4u2nv wrote:

Originally posted by NataleeC NataleeC wrote:

Originally posted by niki_p niki_p wrote:

Nike I have a question: what does compacted frizz mean?


I think it's frizz that stays close to your scalp..

yup...dense packed together frizz
hmmm, thanks. I'm a bit confused. I thought my hair was silky but it doesn't look like the pics posted. Or it could be and combined with other factors or mixed with thready/cottony etc which makes it respond differently.Confused

Its' possible to have more than one characteristic...

Sometimes I identify as cottony/silky

How does your hair respond to water, and moisture? Porosity?


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Posted By: Velvet Vee
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 9:46pm
OMG I love this thread


Posted By: mangachan
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 9:50pm
This is cool but it's alot.  I need to read this on my day off and figure out what I am.I KNOW I ain't silky or course.


Posted By: Lilnicka4u2nv
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 9:56pm
Originally posted by bbthamd bbthamd wrote:

If there is ever a Mt. Rushmore of Natural Hair you will definitely get my vote to be on it. This is too good.

I just now saw this LOL

thank you hun...I hope this helps everyone...

  I do wanna go through each hair texture and discuss what type of products would work best for them, but that would require alot more time and research to put together...


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Posted By: ummmok
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 10:04pm
Originally posted by Lilnicka4u2nv Lilnicka4u2nv wrote:



my hair twin!!

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Why Worry? God's in Control



Posted By: niki_p
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 10:10pm
Originally posted by Lilnicka4u2nv Lilnicka4u2nv wrote:

Originally posted by niki_p niki_p wrote:

Originally posted by Lilnicka4u2nv Lilnicka4u2nv wrote:

Originally posted by NataleeC NataleeC wrote:

Originally posted by niki_p niki_p wrote:

Nike I have a question: what does compacted frizz mean?


I think it's frizz that stays close to your scalp..

yup...dense packed together frizz
hmmm, thanks. I'm a bit confused. I thought my hair was silky but it doesn't look like the pics posted. Or it could be and combined with other factors or mixed with thready/cottony etc which makes it respond differently.Confused

Its' possible to have more than one characteristic...

Sometimes I identify as cottony/silky

How does your hair respond to water, and moisture? Porosity?
low porosity, when I did the strand test, it took forever to get under the water's surface. Coarse and smooth, medium-thick, dense. Refuses to hold a twist out-halfway up the strands hold it better no matter the product. When washing, parts get soaking rest and other parts get damp-ish. Old pics but the best pics I have:

http://public.fotki.com/niki-p/my-mane/p7220341.html - http://public.fotki.com/niki-p/my-mane/p7220341.html
http://public.fotki.com/niki-p/stylings/bhmnaturalstylechal-1.html#media - http://public.fotki.com/niki-p/stylings/bhmnaturalstylechal-1.html#media
http://images29.fotki.com/v1011/photos/9/1371029/7698277/P4180112-vi.jpg - http://images29.fotki.com/v1011/photos/9/1371029/7698277/P4180112-vi.jpg  my hair was a bit damp here I think
http://images44.fotki.com/v1535/photos/9/1371029/7698277/P4240139-vi.jpg - http://images44.fotki.com/v1535/photos/9/1371029/7698277/P4240139-vi.jpg


Posted By: sasha299
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 10:13pm
Thanks so much for this thread and the information in it.
I found out I have low porosity and silky fine strands with thin density.


Posted By: Lilnicka4u2nv
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 10:19pm
Originally posted by niki_p niki_p wrote:

Originally posted by Lilnicka4u2nv Lilnicka4u2nv wrote:

Originally posted by niki_p niki_p wrote:

Originally posted by Lilnicka4u2nv Lilnicka4u2nv wrote:

Originally posted by NataleeC NataleeC wrote:

Originally posted by niki_p niki_p wrote:

Nike I have a question: what does compacted frizz mean?


I think it's frizz that stays close to your scalp..

yup...dense packed together frizz
hmmm, thanks. I'm a bit confused. I thought my hair was silky but it doesn't look like the pics posted. Or it could be and combined with other factors or mixed with thready/cottony etc which makes it respond differently.Confused

Its' possible to have more than one characteristic...

Sometimes I identify as cottony/silky

How does your hair respond to water, and moisture? Porosity?
low porosity, when I did the strand test, it took forever to get under the water's surface. Coarse and smooth, medium-thick, dense. Refuses to hold a twist out-halfway up the strands hold it better no matter the product. When washing, parts get soaking rest and other parts get damp-ish. Old pics but the best pics I have:

http://public.fotki.com/niki-p/my-mane/p7220341.html - http://public.fotki.com/niki-p/my-mane/p7220341.html
http://public.fotki.com/niki-p/stylings/bhmnaturalstylechal-1.html#media - http://public.fotki.com/niki-p/stylings/bhmnaturalstylechal-1.html#media
http://images29.fotki.com/v1011/photos/9/1371029/7698277/P4180112-vi.jpg - http://images29.fotki.com/v1011/photos/9/1371029/7698277/P4180112-vi.jpg  my hair was a bit damp here I think
http://images44.fotki.com/v1535/photos/9/1371029/7698277/P4240139-vi.jpg - http://images44.fotki.com/v1535/photos/9/1371029/7698277/P4240139-vi.jpg


Based on your last,this description, and by the looks of it, you may be a low porosity thready or cottony , i'm leaning more towards cottony

 Thready-  hair has a low sheen, with a high shine while the hair is being held taught with low frizz.  Wets easily but dries quickly.

Cottony – has a low sheen, a high shine if hair is held taut and has high frizz.  Absorbs water quickly but does not get thoroughly wet very fast.


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Posted By: bajanbklyngirl
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 10:43pm
So informative *goes and bookmarks for future reference*

however, these beautiful pics are not good for a long-termer. *hides scissors now*


Went back to read in its entirety.
I am wiry/spongy with fine strands and low porosity. Big smile


-------------
30 Month Transition
BC Date: 12/7/12

~SL~APL~BSL~MBL

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0An2guFmfaZl6dGNDeWhMNDNLakxkMzdCWVB1LU5wUUE" rel="nofollow - Challenge


Posted By: iLoveMrCortez
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 11:11pm
Great thread!!!Thumbs Up

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SNATCHIN WIGS & TAKIN NAMES


Posted By: uppitynegroid
Date Posted: Nov 05 2011 at 11:56pm
I think I'm cottony.  Not sure though.

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Omi te mi o ni san koja mi.



Posted By: nikietc
Date Posted: Nov 06 2011 at 12:02am
still unsure Cry

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-----
"Shoes are important things for a woman. Good shoes will take you to good places." ~Min Seo Hyun, Boys Over Flowers


Posted By: niki_p
Date Posted: Nov 06 2011 at 12:54am
Thanks again Nika. This just helped a lot.


Posted By: AmberColour
Date Posted: Nov 06 2011 at 1:07am
Originally posted by nikietc nikietc wrote:

still unsure Cry
As am I..Ermm


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Posted By: datigress2005
Date Posted: Nov 06 2011 at 1:09am
Smh and I'm still confused...probably more than before. I'll have to post pictures one day. Maybe at my year mark next week I'll take some. But y'all may not be able to truly tell from what I've heard.

*confuses self more*


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GENNNNNNN!!!!!!


Posted By: NataleeC
Date Posted: Nov 06 2011 at 1:20am
Originally posted by datigress2005 datigress2005 wrote:

Smh and I'm still confused...probably more than before. I'll have to post pictures one day. Maybe at my year mark next week I'll take some. But y'all may not be able to truly tell from what I've heard.

*confuses self more*



Hope you sort out all this confusion, tigress.
-holds back snicker-

-------------
APL BSL ~MBL~ WL
Start Length: CBL
Hair length post cut: FNL
Cut Date: Nov 28,2010
Hair Goal for 2012: MBL/WL
Status: Transitioning.
PS: Full Sew Ins
Journey Start Date: Feb. 21, 2010.


Posted By: Lilnicka4u2nv
Date Posted: Nov 06 2011 at 5:39am
Originally posted by datigress2005 datigress2005 wrote:

Smh and I'm still confused...probably more than before. I'll have to post pictures one day. Maybe at my year mark next week I'll take some. But y'all may not be able to truly tell from what I've heard.

*confuses self more*

what exactly puzzles you?


hows does your hair respond to moisture?porosity?

how does it feel?


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Posted By: Sleek
Date Posted: Nov 06 2011 at 6:50am
Great thread.
 
thready all the way, my hair dries in one hot flash and I think I may be silky still a little unsure but I'm definitely thready.


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Posted By: Swift
Date Posted: Nov 06 2011 at 9:40am
4 a/b (I guess) with some straight/wavy hairs sprinkled throughout, fine, cottony, silky nape, normal porosity.
WARNING:  VERY pic heavy!!! (No WNGs or curl definition pics)
 
 
 
 
Strand size
 
Wet n Naked
 
Dry n Naked
 
Styled
 
Wet n Naked (after DC)
 
STYLED
 
Bantu Knot Out
 
Mini-Twists -- THE DEVIL!!! Left me with rough ends and lots of shedding. Never again!
 
Mini-Braids -- My go-to low mani style
 
 
Braidouts- My go-to loose style
 
Twistouts- meh
 
FRO!!- My favorite natural style (coming from someone who swore against "the fro")
Stretched Hair
 
Blow out -- Fine hair means blowout fro is NOT cool :(
 
Blownout Frohawk-
 
Fro Puff-
 
 
 
I've already seen one hair cousin (MissyPooh), are there any more?


-------------
BC: 10-Jun-09, 0" Ceasar
Ayurveda * Low cones/sulfates * Low Manipulation
LTG: Big poofy hair
Trying to KISS
http://public.fotki.com/MzSwift/


Posted By: KhiaMarie
Date Posted: Nov 06 2011 at 9:59am
Originally posted by Swift Swift wrote:

4 a/b (I guess) with some straight/wavy hairs sprinkled throughout, fine, cottony, silky nape, normal porosity.

 
 
I've already seen one hair cousin (MissyPooh), are there any more?



Oh oh oh! i think we might be some type of distant cousins or even close cousins...But maybe more so like a mothers cousin...I think thats a 2nd cousin...Would that make them removed? I never did understand that.

Anyway I think you're a cousin/sister and simjam is a half twin.


Posted By: KhiaMarie
Date Posted: Nov 06 2011 at 10:01am
Oh and btw. Nika very informative. I'm going to have to do some test later to see what I am.

And btw I hate you all! All this hair PICS. I'm in braids. :( *touches new growth* Its just not the same. Cry


Posted By: Carib_n_curly
Date Posted: Nov 06 2011 at 10:12am
my hair has low porosity and its either silky or thready. i'm leaning towards thready
i'm not sure though Disapprove


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^_^


Posted By: Lilnicka4u2nv
Date Posted: Nov 06 2011 at 11:10am
Swift your hair is so damn sexy , im jealous of your perfectly round froCry

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Posted By: Swift
Date Posted: Nov 06 2011 at 11:33am
Khia-
Yay!  Another hair cousin!
 
Nike-
Thanks, beauty!Embarrassed


-------------
BC: 10-Jun-09, 0" Ceasar
Ayurveda * Low cones/sulfates * Low Manipulation
LTG: Big poofy hair
Trying to KISS
http://public.fotki.com/MzSwift/


Posted By: luvmybiga$$fro
Date Posted: Nov 06 2011 at 1:05pm
Very informative and well researched, Nike!

-------------
Happy 9th Nappiversay to Me and Cleo!


Posted By: **Sk!TtLeS B**
Date Posted: Nov 06 2011 at 2:50pm
Teacher Nike, can I have more than one texture on my head as I do curl pattern??Like, can part of my hair be thready, another wiry, and the other cottony?


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Im making a political statement every time I make my ass clap - Ru Paul




Posted By: Lilnicka4u2nv
Date Posted: Nov 06 2011 at 2:56pm
Originally posted by **Sk!TtLeS B** **Sk!TtLeS B** wrote:

Teacher Nike, can I have more than one texture on my head as I do curl pattern??Like, can part of my hair be thready, another wiry, and the other cottony?


of course

and don't call me that LOL


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Posted By: csungrl09
Date Posted: Nov 06 2011 at 2:59pm
this is an amazing thread! thank you for putting it together.

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Even with a low LSAT, i'm a hot commodity.


Posted By: tatee
Date Posted: Nov 06 2011 at 3:38pm
well done Nike


Posted By: Choongy
Date Posted: Nov 06 2011 at 3:40pm
Thanks for this girly, have to read it a few times tho, i love looking at all the hair examples 


Posted By: breBR3bre
Date Posted: Nov 06 2011 at 4:16pm
Wooooww Nicka this thread is AAAAMMMMAAAAZZIIINNGGG lol i finally figured my hair out, Im coarse but silky


Posted By: **Sk!TtLeS B**
Date Posted: Nov 06 2011 at 4:59pm
Originally posted by Lilnicka4u2nv Lilnicka4u2nv wrote:

Originally posted by **Sk!TtLeS B** **Sk!TtLeS B** wrote:

Teacher Nike, can I have more than one texture on my head as I do curl pattern??Like, can part of my hair be thready, another wiry, and the other cottony?


of course

and don't call me that LOL


Professor Nike?
La Maestra Nike?LOL


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Im making a political statement every time I make my ass clap - Ru Paul




Posted By: Lilnicka4u2nv
Date Posted: Nov 06 2011 at 5:03pm
No i'm just Nike D.  Embarrassed

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Posted By: Rumbera
Date Posted: Nov 06 2011 at 11:34pm
GreatThread !!!
 
I am a silky..


Posted By: **Sk!TtLeS B**
Date Posted: Nov 07 2011 at 3:39am
Originally posted by Lilnicka4u2nv Lilnicka4u2nv wrote:

No i'm just Nike pHD. - Hair Expert  Embarrassed



Stern SmileKay....LOL
and I mean pH as in acidity and basidity....is basidity even a word?Geek


-------------
Im making a political statement every time I make my ass clap - Ru Paul




Posted By: Lolliren
Date Posted: Nov 07 2011 at 3:41am
Originally posted by **Sk!TtLeS B** **Sk!TtLeS B** wrote:

Originally posted by Lilnicka4u2nv Lilnicka4u2nv wrote:

No i'm just Nike pHD. - Hair Expert  Embarrassed



Stern SmileKay....LOL
and I mean pH as in acidity and basidity....is basidity even a word?Geek

 alkalinity...?Confused


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Posted By: **Sk!TtLeS B**
Date Posted: Nov 07 2011 at 3:42am
Originally posted by Lolliren Lolliren wrote:

Originally posted by **Sk!TtLeS B** **Sk!TtLeS B** wrote:

Originally posted by Lilnicka4u2nv Lilnicka4u2nv wrote:

No i'm just Nike pHD. - Hair Expert  Embarrassed



Stern SmileKay....LOL
and I mean pH as in acidity and basidity....is basidity even a word?Geek

 alkalinity...?Confused


I didnt wanna use that wordTongue


-------------
Im making a political statement every time I make my ass clap - Ru Paul




Posted By: Lolliren
Date Posted: Nov 07 2011 at 3:45am
Smmfh Ermm
eta: im not even natural so idk why im up here LOL


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Posted By: **Sk!TtLeS B**
Date Posted: Nov 07 2011 at 3:48am
Originally posted by Lolliren Lolliren wrote:

Smmfh Ermm
eta: im not even natural so idk why im up here LOL


Just stirring the potErmm

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Im making a political statement every time I make my ass clap - Ru Paul




Posted By: Lolliren
Date Posted: Nov 07 2011 at 3:52am
Originally posted by **Sk!TtLeS B** **Sk!TtLeS B** wrote:


Just stirring the potErmm


I only do that in weaves. Sleepy

Anywaydoe', carry on kinky women!


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Posted By: Soratachi
Date Posted: Nov 07 2011 at 6:05am
Great post.

I am a spongy type.


Posted By: DeeDee58517
Date Posted: Nov 07 2011 at 7:35am
Shame on me for thinking hair type is only a letter and a number. This thread just prove to me how DIVERSE kinky/nappy/afro/natural/curly/etc hair really is!
 
Nike You should post this in the HairTypes section too! Your pics are current and are HD compared to the ones in the thread about hair typing. It will help out a lot of ladies!


-------------
"Temporary layoffs, good times
Easy-credit ripoffs, good times
Scratchin' and survivin', good times...Ain't we lucky we got 'em?"

Check my FOTKI tho ---> http://public.fotki.com/mzdeejay/


Posted By: Lilnicka4u2nv
Date Posted: Nov 07 2011 at 9:08am
Originally posted by DeeDee58517 DeeDee58517 wrote:

Shame on me for thinking hair type is only a letter and a number. This thread just prove to me how DIVERSE kinky/nappy/afro/natural/curly/etc hair really is!
 
Nike You should post this in the HairTypes section too! Your pics are current and are HD compared to the ones in the thread about hair typing. It will help out a lot of ladies!


   Thank you and its OK that you thought that...I did at a point until I choose to go deep and do research on it because alot of the general hairtyping just didn't make sense to me...

I should post it in there...


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Posted By: Lilnicka4u2nv
Date Posted: Nov 07 2011 at 9:22am
Originally posted by **Sk!TtLeS B** **Sk!TtLeS B** wrote:

Originally posted by Lolliren Lolliren wrote:

Originally posted by **Sk!TtLeS B** **Sk!TtLeS B** wrote:

Originally posted by Lilnicka4u2nv Lilnicka4u2nv wrote:

No i'm just Nike pHD. - Hair Expert  Embarrassed



Stern SmileKay....LOL
and I mean pH as in acidity and basidity....is basidity even a word?Geek

 alkalinity...?Confused


I didnt wanna use that wordTongue


use that word and you shall get flamed Stern Smile


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Posted By: **Sk!TtLeS B**
Date Posted: Nov 07 2011 at 2:59pm
Originally posted by Lolliren Lolliren wrote:

Originally posted by **Sk!TtLeS B** **Sk!TtLeS B** wrote:


Just stirring the potErmm


I only do that in weaves. Sleepy

Anywaydoe', carry on kinky women!


LOL


-------------
Im making a political statement every time I make my ass clap - Ru Paul




Posted By: **Sk!TtLeS B**
Date Posted: Nov 07 2011 at 3:01pm
Originally posted by Lilnicka4u2nv Lilnicka4u2nv wrote:

Originally posted by **Sk!TtLeS B** **Sk!TtLeS B** wrote:

Originally posted by Lolliren Lolliren wrote:

Originally posted by **Sk!TtLeS B** **Sk!TtLeS B** wrote:

Originally posted by Lilnicka4u2nv Lilnicka4u2nv wrote:

No i'm just Nike pHD. - Hair Expert  Embarrassed



Stern SmileKay....LOL
and I mean pH as in acidity and basidity....is basidity even a word?Geek

 alkalinity...?Confused


I didnt wanna use that wordTongue


use that word and you shall get flamed Stern Smile


LOLNo worries!! It makes me think of batteries rather than hair, so it didnt even come to mind when I was giving you your appropriate title.


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Im making a political statement every time I make my ass clap - Ru Paul




Posted By: yaya24
Date Posted: Nov 07 2011 at 6:50pm

Nice!!!



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iRep ♥ Naija
TexLAXED 1.25.13'
SL starting alllll the way over. Watch me work.
APL 2013
     
<


Posted By: mangachan
Date Posted: Nov 07 2011 at 9:58pm
I reviewed this thread...and I think I am either cottony or spongy.  I feel like my hair has attributes of both of them.


Posted By: GoldenCherry
Date Posted: Nov 07 2011 at 10:04pm
Thanks Nike!

OMG Swift!! *drooling*


Posted By: Chey
Date Posted: Nov 07 2011 at 10:36pm
is it bad to say that this thread has me jelly of other peoples hair instead of mine ? *blushes*

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http://nylonboutique.bigcartel.com/
https://twitter.com/#!/nylonboutique


Posted By: EllaBella
Date Posted: Nov 07 2011 at 11:28pm
Originally posted by mangachan mangachan wrote:

I reviewed this thread...and I think I am either cottony or spongy.  I feel like my hair has attributes of both of them.
this !

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