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LMKS: Theories on Mental lllness, Race & Violence

 
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melikey View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote melikey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 16 2012 at 7:21am

i thought we were talking the reasoning behind the crimes (proposed mental illness) am no psychologist but i do think the psyche a person who for all intents and purposes is a part of a societal construct where this behavior is nurtured and embraced is completely different from someone who acts contradictory to social norms, even if the result is the same. 

the former would be a completely different functional human being had they been exposed to a different upbringing, that latter being batsh*t crazy.


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ThoughtCouture View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote ThoughtCouture Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 16 2012 at 7:21am
i don't know maysay...that just doesn't pass the sniff test imo.
 
i'd need to see a few case studies of aa men in jail with 20 murder convictions...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote ThoughtCouture Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 16 2012 at 7:25am
Originally posted by Positive K Positive K wrote:

u can't compare a crazy murdering 20 kindergartens for no reason to a drug dealer killing 20 other drug dealers to gain territory over 10 years..not saying the latter is a good thing but there is an economical reason for what he is doing..most murders in the hood are over money...so I think these mass killings in America are unique to socially awkward white men
 
this was my thinking as well...especially gang murderers...most of them kill other gang members (with a few innocent casualties)...not that it's right...but that's how militaries operate...shrugs.
 
but i wasn't sure if she was talking about aa males who had committed other types of murders...
 
either way...killing for fun/fame is not the same as killing to eat/survive...imo...


Edited by ThoughtCouture - Dec 16 2012 at 7:31am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sang Froid Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 16 2012 at 7:29am
Originally posted by Positive K Positive K wrote:

u can't compare a crazy murdering 20 kindergartens for no reason to a drug dealer killing 20 other drug dealers to gain territory over 10 years..not saying the latter is a good thing but there is an economical reason for what he is doing..most murders in the hood are over money...so I think these mass killings in America are unique to socially awkward white men

Yea it's more of a war mindset for drug dealers.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote maysay1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 16 2012 at 7:32am
Originally posted by ThoughtCouture ThoughtCouture wrote:

i don't know maysay...that just doesn't pass the sniff test imo.
 
i'd need to see a few case studies of aa men in jail with 20 murder convictions...

That's my point...you're not going to find people with 20 murder convictions. The point is usually by the time someone is convicted of attempted murder or murder they have already carried out similar acts of violence (that they didn't get convicted of).

For example, many aa male gang members have participated in drive bys. They've committed attempted murder and murder (of completely innocent/defenseless people, including children) and we know that most of them don't get caught, let alone the first time they participate. If a gang member participates in 2, 5, or 10 drive-bys, they could be racking up 40 or 50 victims (attempted murder/murder) in a short amount of time (a couple of years maybe). By the time they do get sent up for a murder, they've committed the same number of violent acts as the one white male mass murderer.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote afrokock Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 16 2012 at 7:32am
there is white to black ratio in mental health institutes that positively correlates to a an upside down   black to white ratio in jail.

thats where it starts.

secondly in the uk, when looking at adolescent/paediatric mental health services data, there is an under representation of black children in treatment services, whilst there is an overrepresentation of black male adults in adult services clearly demonstrating diagnostic flaws

there is so much to look at..

family history, ed background, ses, religion, shoot even diet




Edited by afrokock - Dec 16 2012 at 7:35am
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maysay1 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (3) Thanks(3)   Quote maysay1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 16 2012 at 7:37am
And I'm really not understanding this romanticized notion of gang members as survivalists who are killing just to eat/survive.

This goes back to a thread we had a couple of months ago where I said that this is community supported violence. Gang members are generally not homeless or starving. They are being fed, clothed, and housed by their parents, grandparents, baby mamas, homies, lovers and friends. AND the government since many of them are eligible for and receive SSI, SDI, SNAP benefits, SS death benefits, and various forms of medicare.

Either way, growing up impoverished, traumatized, with ptsd, and black male in america syndrome does not change the act of violence. A murder is a murder is a murder.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ThoughtCouture Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 16 2012 at 7:38am
Originally posted by maysay1 maysay1 wrote:

Originally posted by ThoughtCouture ThoughtCouture wrote:

i don't know maysay...that just doesn't pass the sniff test imo.
 
i'd need to see a few case studies of aa men in jail with 20 murder convictions...

That's my point...you're not going to find people with 20 murder convictions. The point is usually by the time someone is convicted of attempted murder or murder they have already carried out similar acts of violence (that they didn't get convicted of).

For example, many aa male gang members have participated in drive bys. They've committed attempted murder and murder (of completely innocent/defenseless people, including children) and we know that most of them don't get caught, let alone the first time they participate. If a gang member participates in 2, 5, or 10 drive-bys, they could be racking up 40 or 50 victims (attempted murder/murder) in a short amount of time (a couple of years maybe). By the time they do get sent up for a murder, they've committed the same number of violent acts as the one white male mass murderer.


 
oh so you are talking about gang members...the only reason i asked to see case studies is to pinpoint what type of murders you were referring too.
 
anyway, gang members usually directly target other gang members over territory/money.  like a govt/military would.  in both cases, of course there will be casualites.  but this is not the intended purpose of the attack.  yt males purposely set out to mass murder random people for fun/attention/fame.  i believe this is a distinction that warrants notating...


Edited by ThoughtCouture - Dec 16 2012 at 7:38am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote afrokock Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 16 2012 at 7:38am
Originally posted by maysay1 maysay1 wrote:

And I'm really not understanding this romanticized notion of gang members as survivalists who are killing just to eat/survive.

This goes back to a thread we had a couple of months ago where I said that this is community supported violence. Gang members are generally not homeless or starving. They are being fed, clothed, and housed by their parents, grandparents, baby mamas, homies, lovers and friends. AND the government since many of them are eligible for and receive SSI, SDI, SNAP benefits, SS death benefits, and various forms of medicare.

Either way, growing up impoverished, traumatized, with ptsd, and black male in america syndrome does not change the act of violence. A murder is a murder is a murder.
i thought the thread was about predictors of violence?



or am i mistaken?
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ThoughtCouture View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ThoughtCouture Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 16 2012 at 7:40am
Originally posted by maysay1 maysay1 wrote:

And I'm really not understanding this romanticized notion of gang members as survivalists who are killing just to eat/survive.

 
 
i don't think anyone is doing that...Confused
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